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Trends and Insight in association withSynapse Virtual Production
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Pinterest’s Malik Ducard on Why Positivity Is a Choice for Platforms

29/03/2023
Publication
London, UK
355
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While polarisation rages across the internet, Pinterest’s chief content officer talks to LBB’s Laura Swinton about how people and brands alike are seeking solace and inspiration online

“As a human being on this planet, I really want to be a part of an organisation that puts, at the front, doing good by the world and by the future and the fundamental belief that by doing good you can do well. The two aren’t accidentally married, they’re actually directly connected.”

Malik Ducard joined Pinterest a year and a half ago as chief content officer and since then he’s been working with creators and brands, shaping content in alignment with the platform’s goal to spread inspiration and positivity to the online world and our offline lives. Having joined from YouTube where he was VP of content partnerships, he says that Pinterest’s mission and its drive to create a healthier online environment has been both personally motivating and appealing to the creators and brands that he works with.

“We really try to centre this notion of inspiration and positivity, and centre our user, the ‘pinner’. When pinners come through the front door of Pinterest, they're really coming with intent in mind. They're coming to do, to bake, to create, to shop. Those are extrinsic examples. There are intrinsic examples as well. They come to meditate, they come to journal, they come to grow, and that is really different to how people arrive at other platforms.” 

He describes the experience of working with the Pinterest team, content creators and partners as “absolutely wonderful” and as he talks, it becomes clear that there’s a real alignment between his personal moral compass, Pinterest’s lofty mission and the day-to-day requirements of his job of supporting content and creators and bringing them together with brands.

“Pinners, users and folks on the internet are really seeking more safe, healthy and positive environments - by the way, so too are creators, publishers and brands,” he says.

It’s something the company takes so seriously that in February this year, Pinterest’s CEO put out an essay in which he likened social media to Big Tobacco - a shocking statement for someone who runs a social media platform. His piece underlines the responsibility platforms have for the choices they make around AI and the behaviours their algorithms foster. 

At a time when AI is seeing an explosion, it’s easy to feel like the technology is running away from us and sweeping us along in its wake towards a sinister-looking future. However, says Malik, those that build and use algorithms have the power and responsibility to make a difference. From a content perspective, the algorithms that run Pinterest are created to surface and prioritise the content that has that positive impact on users rather than polarising clickbait.

“Algorithms are a choice,” says Malik, simply. “They learn, they’re trained, they’re taught - what do you optimise your systems for? We aren’t perfect and our North Star is to constantly work at it to ensure that our systems prioritise inspirational experiences that are positive, that are done at scale for people on the platforms from pinners to creatives for publishers and brands. That’s how we optimise. And by the way, in the back of the system it really does pull in these signals, this content, and understanding of the user journey and an understanding where it surfaces content that is more likely to leave someone feeling more inspired than tired.”

One example of this is the assertion that ‘not every minute on the internet is created equal’, so the KPIs that Pinterest uses don’t emphasise things like time spent and dwell time but the quality of interaction and engagement. Malik emphasises that Pinterest isn’t claiming to always get it right - just like the pro-active pinners, they’re always seeking to grow.

Even aside from the mechanisms of the platform itself, Pinterest has been front-footed in its content policies, in terms of banning weight loss ads, climate misinformation and tackling political misinformation in order to keep the whole ecosystem healthy. Inclusivity is also really important and Malik says that the platform has been developed with the diversity of creators and pinners in mind.

“We have an inclusive product effort where pinners and creators see themselves in the content a lot more - whether its hair pattern search where you can search for content that’s driven by your hair type to skin tone, where you can really surface content that is a mirror of you,” he says.

“The original promise of the internet that we were all excited about was that the internet, taken broadly, was going to bring people together, bridge people and help society. That information would be shared and people would learn… and look at what happened,” says Malik. “The internet actually pulled people apart. I think in a lot of ways we’re trying to get back to that original promise of bringing people together, and to share the information and ideas to take them from inspiration to realisation and actually doing things with their own lives.”

The vision for a better kind of internet comes at the perfect time - not only is AI exploding, but the emergence of web3 is also the perfect opportunity to build that positive intent into the next wave of the internet from its foundations. Of course, this positivity is very much Pinterest’s USP, but that doesn’t mean it’s something they’re hoarding.

“You know, we were focused on building a really great, positive, inspiring experience for pinners, creators, publishers and brands. But we are also people who live in the world, and we want a better world as well. Part of what you saw in Bill’s piece, and why he wanted to talk publicly is that this is, if not a model, but the contours of a set up that can do good,” says Malik. The Pinterest model is not necessarily one that can be directly applied to other online businesses and spaces, the emphasis on fostering healthy, positive behaviours is certainly a choice that anyone can make.

It’s a pitch that’s proving popular with brands looking for a safe and positive space, free from outrage culture. Pinterest also emphasises positive actions and engagements with content over time spent, and that’s sitting well with brands who are realising that they have much less to gain from people passively spending hours at a time online than they do from people who are motivated to turn ideas into actions.

The reason why brands and creators and publishers are engaged is because Pinterest is really seen as a place for doing things, a place for going from the discovery of an idea to action,” says Malik. “Maybe you just have a colour in mind or an aesthetic for a room or a general place on earth that you’d like to visit but you don’t know specifically, it starts with that discovery and then it helps you get to a decision. And then it actually helps you do that thing - that may be buying something to help with your remodel or ingredients for a recipe, or a trip or an outlook.”

The connection between brands and creators is where Malik and his team come in. He points to examples of brands like eBay, which has recently worked with three creators in the UK to spotlight opportunities for pinners. Retailers like Argos have used Pinterest to showcase their homeware lines in a fun but shoppable way. In Germany, printer brand Brother worked with 15 creators to connect with audiences and show how the printers can help them turn ideas into reality.

“We’ve been doing more and more of this. The global mechanism is called ‘Idea Ads with Paid Partnerships’, and that area, for us, has been growing really meaningfully, because brands are looking for people in that discovery-to-doing journey and creators and publishers have a natural connection with their audiences.”

For Malik, the aspect of his role that really brings him the most joy is working with creators. It’s something that he’s always loved. Before entering the world of the platforms, Malik spent half his career in Hollywood, working for studios like MGM, Paramount and Lionsgate, where acquiring movies and content and distribution was his bread and butter. And while the old school studio system, with its hierarchies and traditions, might seem a million miles away from the free and open world of a platform like Pinterest, what’s always given him joy is the ability to empower creative people. Now he gets to do that at scale. 

“I absolutely see and feel a connective tissue and a through line,” he reflects. “I feel amazingly fortunate to be able to work with storytellers who are working to change the world. That’s what I did, well I’m afraid to count out the years, two decades ago, and that’s what I do today. I think maybe one of the differences is that, today, there’s the opportunity to hear the voices of storytellers that are dynamic, diverse and who don’t require specific human gatekeepers to say, ‘yes, you can share this idea’.”
 
And because he cares about the creators, he cares about the experience they have. All of that foundational work around the algorithms, around the behavioural levers and the overall culture means that people aren’t torn to shreds for daring to step up and create, “I heard from creators all the time that the comments are supportive on Pinterest. That’s… “ he pauses,” not something that people say about comments on the internet! Find me another place where they’re saying that.”


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